Does anyone else out there do a steaming only paysite for monthly subscriptions?
We are thinking of dropping the download features and just running h.264 streaming. no mp4, no wmv, no flv, just pure streaming h.264
is this a good idea? or have others not done well with this model?
thanks for your input
Marc Sterling
Dickbank.com
Re: Streaming only paysites
Why would you want to do that?
In what way would that benefit your customer (potential)?
Re: Streaming only paysites
Are thinking is that the majority of customers just want to watch and jack off. not fuss with waiting to download and storing files.
We see from our aebn theater and other vod services that there is plenty of customers happy with streaming only. Most of those customers have no desire to download.
For downloads, we are thinking of a pay per scene model.
or is it expected that if you join a paysite that it will have all the files available for download?
just checking the pulse out there.
Re: Streaming only paysites
Streaming can theoretically save you bandwidth, plus it also can make the end-user experience seem loads faster. If you’re going to go this route though, I’d recommend going with nginx+mp4 streaming (with jwplayer) – it flattens Apache for performance + resource efficiency. Let me know if you have questions/want or need tech help here, I’ve set up the whole stack from ffmpeg up way more times than I care to remember 
-doug
Re: Streaming only paysites
My experience with this is the consumer is going to want to own the video(s) he / she likes or wants. They’ll visit your site, they’ll join, once they figure out how to steal it to save it, they will. If they can’t, they’ll leave and go somewhere where they can download and save. That’s why paysites that offer download content do so well.
We have paysites as well. We offered the same as you, and wmv’s. They rarely watched the streaming ones. At one point, we did offer streaming, our cancellation ratio was high, so then we offered downloadables once we did that our cancellation ratios dropped. Right there shows the consumers want to own it.
Re: Streaming only paysites
Yeah people tend to get upset when they cant keep the files locally (though its not to hard to figure out that you can save flv/mp4 files in a multitude of ways). Why not offer both options?
Re: Streaming only paysites
I think majority of customers just want to watch not download, maybe only download when like a lot a video.
Re: Streaming only paysites
My suggestion would be…
If you’re worried about content theft, offer streaming but also offer a download with DRM. That way, those that really want to download can.
Yes, everyone says DRM is evil, but so is stealing and it seems like the Internet was invented to aid in stealing.
I don’t subscribe to the whole “people should get to own your content if they become a member” theory. Members are only buying access, which is why it’s called a membership.
Look at DVDs – you buy a couple of scenes for the same price as a month of website membership. Yet with a membership, you get A LOT more than four or six scenes. So, people shouldn’t get to own 70 scenes for the same price they’d pay to own 4 to 6.
Most disagree with me but I’m a capitalist.
Streaming won’t stop most tube sites from ripping you off though … there are great Firefox Plugin’s and other programs that let you rip a stream.
I reserve the right to change my opinion; my thoughts on this subject go back and forth depending on the day.
Re: Streaming only paysites
I think it depends on the contentâ¦.
Short form content shot primarily for the internet tends to have a higher % of users that actually want to download the content. Long form content shot primarily for DVD or as a âfilmâ tends to be more streaming, with a lower % of downloads.
I think for the average customer they just want to watch it when they want to watch it. If they can get to the content easily and watch it quickly, then the need to download and own diminishes. The average customer does not want to wait for downloads, they want to watch it streaming immediately. AEBN has about $100 million in evidence to prove that point. Less than 5% of their business is in downloads, itâs all streaming. They also deal primarily in long form content and âfilmsâ, not internet only produced content.
I do think this might be different for more âsceneâ oriented online producers that operate membership sites. They have taught their customer to download and own the content. So, that customer tends to think they get to wont he content and download it.
They are different business models and both have validity.
Re: Streaming only paysites
[QUOTE=MarcSterling;67961]Are thinking is that the majority of customers just want to watch and jack off. not fuss with waiting to download and storing files.
We see from our aebn theater and other vod services that there is plenty of customers happy with streaming only. Most of those customers have no desire to download.
For downloads, we are thinking of a pay per scene model.
or is it expected that if you join a paysite that it will have all the files available for download?
just checking the pulse out there.[/QUOTE]
Any good site should offer it’s customer both. That’s the ideal.
I can tell you with 100% certainty that the only one you will make happy by having ONLY streaming is yourself. VOD does sell because they offer content that might not be available elsewhere and they sell because we send them surfers. It’s not a prefered choice if you like from the surfers perspective.
Pay Per Scene models is in my view a VERY bad idea. Sureflix / Maleflix done that for years and now very much going downhill. I switched White label VOD to Movie Dollars due to their stupid price structure (and bad site layouts).
What you mentioned: “Pay per scene + streaming only” = VOD.
You won’t stand a chance against Movie Dollars and AEBN. Their selection is so broad and extensive. But even their sales are in decline.
If it’s because you want to protect your content, that’s a totally different issue.
Re: Streaming only paysites
Very eye opening reading these customer comments.
Keith Web also has excellent points about different customer types.
Our traditional pay sites will continue to offer surfers downloadable content, however Im not shy about creating a new paysite that looks more dvd orientated and will cost the customer less for streaming only. If we do go this route i will ensure the tour clearly explains that it is a streaming only site. I believe there is also a upsell opportunity that if they like the stream they can choose to purchase the downloadable format for an additional minimal fee, with HD quality.
The goal is not necessarily to prevent pirates, but I do believe the easily downloadable content may encourage the end user to share it, they may not even think they are stealing.
Great input and discussion!
Re: Streaming only paysites
that’s not what my porn surfer friends tell me, nor my clients’ stats. i keep hearing that most of the videos are downloaded. i’m sure it can be different from site to site, but my experience is otherwise.
Re: Streaming only paysites
[QUOTE=MarcSterling;68017]
Our traditional pay sites will continue to offer surfers downloadable content, however Im not shy about creating a new paysite that looks more dvd orientated and will cost the customer less for streaming only. If we do go this route i will ensure the tour clearly explains that it is a streaming only site. I believe there is also a upsell opportunity that if they like the stream they can choose to purchase the downloadable format for an additional minimal fee, with HD quality. ![/QUOTE]
I hate to break it to you, but what you are talking about is nothing new, neither anything ground breaking. Loads of sites have done it before, most of them have failed. You assume too many things and ignore some solid well known facts. Consumers will always want to download the videos and feel that the membership pays for that right. Explaining it on the tour will only get you less sales.
For example, Titan or Manifest Men can get away with doing only streaming. Why? Their content is so exclusive, high quality and well known that people will pay no matter what. i.e. Branding.
There was a site a couple of years ago who did what you mentioned, owned by a straight company with a lot of money behind it. They had a large amount of content and offered only streaming. They utterly failed, and now has converted to a free tube upselling crap memberships.
Don’t get me wrong, I understand there are valid reasons for doing streaming only and our industry is suffering greatly because of piracy, but unfortunately the facts, stats and surfer behaviour will probably mean such a site will fail. It’s hard enough starting a new “normal” site.
Re: Streaming only paysites
I don’t know what other porn addicts do, but my wife hates streaming, and when he joins a site, he loves to download them, and jerk off to them later on. But then again, he is a horny bitch lol
Re: Streaming only paysites
DRM is dead and so full of holes that its not worth to bother using it or subjecting your users to the whole mess… At least if we are taking about anything that uses microsofts DRM… Has been broken for the last 2-3 years and removing the “protection” is easy as pie.
regarding steaming only, it can be done but you can expect some users to move on when they find out that you do not offer downloadable movies but if you “sell” it right on the tour page then the fall out will be minimal.
[QUOTE=QueerLust;68004]My suggestion would be…
If you’re worried about content theft, offer streaming but also offer a download with DRM. That way, those that really want to download can.
Yes, everyone says DRM is evil, but so is stealing and it seems like the Internet was invented to aid in stealing.[/QUOTE]
Re: Streaming only paysites
Streaming is great but people want to be able to download the videos. Its as if they get a value for their money.
Re: Streaming only paysites
those guys have it streaming only and it works just great
http://www.gaydemon.biz/showthread.php?t=12549
Re: Streaming only paysites
[QUOTE=daizzzy;68231]those guys have it streaming only and it works just great
http://www.gaydemon.biz/showthread.php?t=12549[/QUOTE]
You call 1 in 1400 ratio working? Don’t think so. No rebills either. :no: